Re: For feminists - The bottom line about rape

Sky King wrote:

> "Darkfalz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>
> > "Cele" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > > On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 14:00:27 +1100, "Darkfalz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > A lot of women get raped by exercising their rights. Their right to dress
> > > > slutty and still feel safe. Their right to be alone with a guy they
> >
> > barely
> >
> > > > know, being drunk, and expecting him to respect her boundaries. Their
> >
> > right
> >
> > > > to be sexually assertive, even agressive, but still have the right to say
> > > > "no" at any time.
> > > >
> > > > Listen, idiots, this is the bottom line.
> > > >
> > > > You may have the legal right to do any and all of those things, but do
> >
> > you
> >
> > > > WANT to be raped? Or more specifically, would you like to AVOID being
> >
> > raped?
> >
> > > > The answer is probably yes.
> > > >
> > > > Curtailing all of the above behaviours will massively minimise your risk
> >
> > of
> >
> > > > being raped. You have to accept having the right to do something doesn't
> > > > make you invincible. I may have the right to provoke someone twice my
> >
> > size,
> >
> > > > but if I do it I'm liable to get my skull cracked. I may have the right
> >
> > to
> >
> > > > walk down a dark alley at night in a bad neighbourhood in expensive
> >
> > clothes,
> >
> > > > but odds are if it happens, I'm going to get mugged - even killed.
>
>
> And you would have to take some personal responsibility for making that BAD
> choice.  Does it mean you deserve to be mugged..of course not but you still
> have to take responsibility for your choices.   Same goes for women that
> put themselves in a risky situation...it does not excuse the rape but the
> woman bears the some responsibility if she put herself in a bad situation.
>
> > > > Use your common sense and get over this idea that "independence" means
> > > > constantly tempting fate by doing stupid things.
> > > >
> > > > Rape (outside of prisons) is avoidable in 99.9% of sitatuations. This
> >
> > goes
> >
> > > > for adult women, naturally a child being abused may not be able to avoid
> >
> > it,
> >
> > > > but if you're an adult then you really have no excuse for not keeping
> > > > yourself safe.
> > > >
> > > > So if you don't want to be raped, it's entirely in your hands. And if you
> > > > have been raped, for God sakes, LEARN FROM IT and don't let it happen
> >
> > again.
> >
> > > That's a fascinating take on things.
> > >
> > > While I think reasonable safety precautions are a good idea, I'd be
> > > interested to know how you think the victim of Marcellus Jacob invoked
> > > her own rape by her behaviour. In that case, Jacob broke into the home
> > > of a woman he didn't know, duct taped her, raped and sodomised her at
> > > knife point, forced various noxious substances including bear spray
> > > (pepper spray) into her orifices, and otherwise tortured her for five
> > > hours. She was just home minding her own business. Here's the news
> > > report: http://www.whitehorsestar.com/ I was in town at the time. I
> > > remember it well. It was in the press during my own daughter's
> > > hospitalisation for the results of her having been abducted on her way
> > > to school and raped at knifepoint for four and a half or so hours -
> > > different town, different perp.
>
>
> I do not think that falls into the category he was talking about.

He said 99.9% of rape survivors fall into his 'category.' I know 
personally, maybe, six rape survivors. One was intoxicated and date 
raped. The other six were not. I've described two above. Another was a 
teenager of 14, walking home from a friend's place in mid afternoon in 
the summer, abducted and raped. Two were raped by known family members 
as prepubescent children. That's five of six who couldn't possibly come 
close. I recognise that my personal experience isn't a statistically 
valid sample size, but it's not without weight, either.

> > One thing I forgot to mention was drinking in excess. There has been a
> > MASSIVE increase in young females binge drinking. Now these women get
> > totally off their face drunk, fuck a guy they just met, and wake up groggy
> > as hell in the morning and believe they are a victim of "drug rape" when
> > they had injested enough alcohol to put them in a coma.
> >
> > If you can't learn to limit yourself then don't blame others for the
> > consequences when you get too drunk to think or control yourself.
>
>
>
> Ah...personal responsibility, something that few feminist believe in.

We're talking about rape. If what you're saying is that rape survivors 
ought to take 'personal responsibility' for 'errors of judgement' that 
you feel have contributed to the commission of a crime against them, 
then I presume that this goes also for victims of FRAs, who, according 
to this standard, ought not to associate with the 'wrong kind of women' 
and ought to be more careful and so on and so forth?

Cele