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On 22 Nov 2003 02:18:24 -0800 Kate Orman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>... > Daran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message > news:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>... >> On 21 Nov 2003 11:00:29 -0800 Sky King <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in >> message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>... > >> >> > Gee...according to many feminist women never lie about being >> >> > raped.....:) > >> >> Name one. > > [They can't.] Of course they can't. >> I should like to accept Neil's challenge myself. I name the Santa Barbara >> Rape Crisis Center as a (corporate) person, and Harriet Eckstein as an >> individual person who was the director of that body. >> >> Proof that SBRCC says this: >> <http://www.sbrapecrisiscenter.org/04Information/myth2.html> >> >> Proof that SBRCC is feminist: <http://www.sbrapecrisiscenter.org/01About >> Us/about.html> >> >> (This is a space in that URL, which might break some newsreader's auto >> linking.) >> >> Evidence of Eckstein's involvement with the SBRCC: >> <http://www.sbjuggle.org/html/ArticleIndependent.html> > > To be fair, the SBRCC page goes on at once to talk about a low level > of false reports, so they're not really making the obviously incorrect > claim that women *never* lie about rape. So we still don't really have > an example. Give a guy a break, will you? I can't find a feminist saying 'women never lie about rape' because there are no feminists saying this. There are no non-feminists saying this. The only people using this sentence are antifeminists whining about these non-existent feminists. My first search, on '"women never lie" rape', turned up no examples of actual usage. None at all. Zero. Zilch. Ninguno! However, the sentence 'Women don't lie about rape' is used quite frequently, and the cite referenced contained it. I'll let Neil adjudicate whether I've met his challenge or not. > OTOH, the SBRCC do use the oft-quoted FBI/2% claim. I've never been > able to track this figure back to its origins, though I've seen it in > many reputable sources... So have I. I suggest that the appearance of a dubious statistic in a reputable source tends to detract from the latter, without enhancing the former. > ...(It may be a misreading of two separate studies > mentioned cheek-by-jowl in "Against Our Will" - she doesn't make the > claim, but her online critics seem to think she does.) It appears her supporters make the same misreading them. I consider the figure to be a myth, until proven otherwise, and I find it very disappointing that so many of pages turned up by a search on 'rape myths' are perpetuating what they purport to debunk. > I'm researching the incidence of false rape reports for an essay. > There seems to be little evidence that false reports, let alone false > accusations or convictions, are commonplace. Clearly they do happen, > but are infrequent compared to genuine reports, or unreported rapes. > (Any number of news items of false reports could be countered with > large numbers of stories about convictions.) Oh sure. I could find more verifiable rape cases in a day than he's turned up of verifiable FRAs in his entire time here. But to play the game is to endorse it. I condemned the sockpuppetry attributed to Chive Mynde when it was it was going on here. I'm not about to engage in similar. > A couple of studies constantly get dredged up - the unpublished Air > Force study cited by Farrell in "Myth of Male Power", which I'd love > to get my hands on (the study, not the book :-),... And presumably not Farrell himself. :-) > ...and Kanin's study of > motives for false reports... Have you seen any more of it than Harbison's redaction? Kerry told me that she had a copy once, but no longer has. > (Generalising the incidence in the latter > to all rape reports would be like my generalising the Pitcairn Island > trial to claim that more than one in ten men are child sex abusers.) > > So those aren't convincing as evidence of common false reports. Do > those claiming a high rate of lies... Now there's a nice turn of phrase. I don't think anyone could challenge the antifems on their rate of lies. > ...have any other evidence? I'll > follow up on any cites I'm given... Are you familiar with the UK's Home Office Research Study 196 (A question of evidence)? It's about rape investigation in general, and you'll have to do a fair bit of data-mining to come up with any figures at all on FRAs. Find it here: <http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs/hors196.pdf> > ...(If anyone can give the original > source for the FBI/2% figure, I'd be very grateful!) I'd also like to know more about the genuine FBI figures of 8% unfounded rape complaints vs. 2% for other crimes. These figures sit in the UCR for years on end, unchanging, with no supporting data, then just disappear. > Yours, > - Kate Orman > http://katesfeminist.info/ -- Daran To fear a power; to fight a power, is very dangerous. To love power and to share it is the royal way -- Gelluk in 'The Finder' by Ursula Le Guin
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