Re: Silveira DENIED Certiorari

Stephan Rothstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]: 

> The Lone Weasel wrote:
> 
>> You're hysterical, so just remember the gunlobby lied to
>> you when it said you have a personal gun right under the
>> Second Amendment.  They just wanted your money.  The gun 
>> manufacturers just wanted you to buy new guns.
> 
> Actually, I think you are the one getting hysterical here.
> You would have us believe that the phrase "the people"
> means something different in one amendment than it does in
> the others. 

No I wouldn't.

> You would also have us believe that in the
> middle of a list of rights reserved to the people and
> limits on the government, they through in a right for the
> states. 

Well, the Tenth Amendment also reserves to the states such 
powers as the internal police, by which you have gun rights 
in the first place.  And two of those original amendments had 
to do with House apportionment in the states and salaries for 
members of congress - the former was rejected by the people, 
the latter ratified in 1992 as the Twenty-Seventh Amendment.  
Also, the Third Amendment originally protected just house 
owners, not everybody, from having to quarter soldiers in 
peacetime.

And when you look at the US Constitution as a whole - instead 
of just the first ten amendments - you see that it's not all 
about individual rights. 

I use this site alot:

http://www.findlaw.com/casecode/constitution/

> The "gun lobby" hasn't lied to me about the right existing.

Yes they have.

> They have not defended it as much as I want.

Why would they?  If you suddenly had a personal right to have 
guns under the Second Amendment, you wouldn't send them money 
anymore.

> As for the gun manufacturers just wanting me to buy more
> guns, I agree with you. 

Thank you.

> I see no problem with that since it
> is their business and it is just like GMC wanting us to buy
> more cars and Anheuser-Busch wanting us to buy more beer.
> That is the basis of business in the US. 

If your computer never became obsolete or stopped working, 
would you feel a duty to buy another one?  Would you feel an 
obligation to the computer industry to keep buying new 
computers?  Or popcorn popppers?  Or dictionaries?

Just guns, eh Schleppen?

___________________


Regardless, the Missouri defeat caused gun advocacy groups 
to change strategies. Before, they had insisted that 
Missourians wanted concealed weapons laws and generally 
welcomed plebiscites on gun issues. Since the defeat of 
Proposition B, the gun lobby in Missouri no longer lobbies 
for referendums anymore. As evidence of this shift, just a 
couple of weeks ago, a referendum proposal for right to 
carry was defeated in the legislature fairly soundly. In 
fact, the argument for right to carry in Missouri now is 
pretty astonishing -- and very disingenuous. Right to carry 
proponents claim that, like during the Civil Rights Movement 
of the 1950s and 1960s that led to a recognition of the 
civil rights of African-Americans and women, the average 
citizen is biased against those who now advocate the "civil 
rights of gun owners." Like in the 1960s, this argument 
goes, the average citizen cannot be trusted to be true to 
the Constitution and support civil (gun) rights, so the gun 
lobby no longer trusts them.

...

Therefore, to avoid involving actual Missouri voters, the 
NRA and the gun lobby in the state is now working 
exclusively with state legislators. It appears that even the 
NRA knows that democracy will likely lead them down the road 
to defeat so they are sending lobbyists to grease the palms 
of legislators with campaign contributions. However, much to 
the NRA's relief it now appears the Missouri legislature is 
going to give them the law they were seeking in 1999. While 
Missouri was the only state bold enough to ask its citizens' 
opinion on this issue, it now appears the legislature is 
quite happy to ignore it. The last potential hope that the 
will of the people will be respected is that Missouri's 
Governor, Bob Holden, will veto the measure once it is 
passed. However, he's shown signs of waffling in the past 
few days.

Does the NRA Mistrust Democracy?

By Thomas Spencer


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The Lone Weasel