Re: KeepAndBearArms.com: Gun Banner Wishes My Family to Be Murdered and Die Slowly

"Mark2101"  wrote in message
> Gun Banner Wishes My Family
> to Be Murdered and Die Slowly
> from Angel Shamaya
> "This incredibly hateful email is worth sharing --
> with full headers included -- to remind gun owners
> that gun banners want us and our families dead.
> His email address is included, should you wish to
> communicate directly with him. His letter has not
> been edited. Typos and misspelling are left intact.
> My response to him follows his very honest hatred."
> http://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/Item.asp?ID=3627
>
> Mark Renfro
> ========================================
You wrote a calm, cogent answer to this person. This is admirable and I support it as 
you attempt to communicate the image of gun
owners as calm reasonable and sociable; a worthy goal on its own merits. But I also 
believe that, with the exception of the posting
on the site, it is a wasted effort. This person will not hear you.

I would like to address the question he asked:
(and will send it to him)
> =======================================
I would love to hear your answer for that although I already can
gues it, "Blah blah 2nd ammendmant blah blah." Well how about
not reciting garbage like that and actually answer the dam question
> ========================================
I am not going to answer with the "Blah blah 2nd amendment."
The second amendment rests upon a "social pact," a belief that we, all of us as 
individuals, form a society. It is assumed that we
all agree that this society is to have rules and that we all agree
that we will willingly abide by those rules. This assumption does not depend upon how 
the rules came into existence, nor does it
depend upon what they are or upon total agreement for the society to function. This 
can be shown by looking at other countries and
how they are ruled.

The base assumption of the social pact in the United States, as in most places, is 
that we are born into it and automatically become
a part of it at birth. For the most part this is seen as such a base assumption that 
it does not even occur in our minds to question
it. Words sometimes obfuscate instead of enlighten. Some words, such as "birthright," 
which includes in its definition: "... such as
an estate descendible by law to an heir, or civil liberty under a free constitution; 
..."

I have mentioned two phrases that are concepts, not to be mistaken for realities. 
These phrases are "automatically become members"
and "willingly abide." This is a cooperative society we are presumed to have been born 
into. The disagreements and minor battles you
see around you, seemingly divisive, are within and a part of that "willingly abide," 
as is the Second Amendment.

I am not sure that you are aware of what you have done when you wish my family and 
myself injured, dying in pain and encourage
others beside yourself to cause this to happen. You have broken that social pact. You 
have shown that my "willingness to abide" is
for naught. You have in effect, not only taken yourself outside of that social pact, 
you have placed me outside of it as well.

I recognize that you are not alone, no matter how unique you feel, and I have met the 
many "you's" throughout my life. You exist in
myriad forms, from a relative that wants and lobbies for gun control to the rabid 
unthinking louts such as yourself. It is a good
thing that I have a place to stand, outside of and totally separate from the social 
pact you base your existence upon. I will try to
explain, but cannot without some type of context.
=======================================
Picture two groups of monkeys prior to the existence of "man" seen to be contesting 
access to a waterhole - a requirement of life
(the opening of 2001 is perfect).

One monkey grabs a bone and begins striking the ground. By accident or design he uses 
it to hit and this gains him the superiority
he needs in order to drink, to remain alive; he survives and so does his mate and 
babies.

He has become a "tool user" and more importantly, a weapon user. You may be sure that 
there will be the continued use of a tool
or weapon to ensure survival. By gradual increment of discovery he will discover a 
bigger and longer club and that throwing the item
will to extend the access to a personal controlled area. As soon as he throws, he has 
developed a "missile." Whether he can express
that or even has the concept, that is what he has done.

It is here, at this time that I would like to mention RIGHTS, but I cannot. What would 
I mention: fundamental rights..?, human
rights..?, right turns..? basic rights..? constitutional rights..?

None of these rights exist. The social pact does not exist. the language to express 
them does not exist, not even the right turn.
They do these things, they "really do them." Society itself, outside of his "immediate 
family" and the stragglers that hang nearby
for proximity protection exist, and that is all that exists. This is reality.

What happened to this reality; did it disappear? Most emphatically NO. This is where 
both you and I now stand, your having placed me
and yourself outside of that social agreement.

Do I need the second amendment? What second amendment, it does not exist for us where 
we stand. Are you or any of those you
encouraged to do so, going to "come for me" with the intent of harm? Yes - I think you 
would or will. I am not fooled by your plea
to
remove my guns as leading to peace between us. Be advised that you have not gotten it 
yet and while I do not expect the "social
pact" to alter to the extent that I will be advised to "give it up" (note that I did 
not say "forced" to give it up), I will have it
when you come.

Should this country change, by being "taken over" by others or by being altered to 
suit you, do not believe that I will
"automatically" become a member of the new "social pact." I am comfortable out here. I 
am capable of reverting to the status of
"club maker" and "missile maker" in most of its incarnations and am quite willing to 
do so. The basic principle that you do not
understand is that you depend upon me and my capability and my attitudes for your 
survival. You cannot win unarmed, never have,
never will. And you do think well enough or talk politely enough for anyone that would 
allow you to survive as "peripherally
protected" by their ability. I
would say in closing "Be seeing you..." but I don't think I will...
JR
====================================
"Confronted with the choice, the American people would choose the policeman's 
truncheon over the anarchist's bomb."
-Spiro T. Agnew