Re: Shooting Ourselves in the Foot

"rick etter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> "Andrew Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > "Dutch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >
> > > "Andrew Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > "Dutch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > > "ta" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote
> > > > > > Interesting how this letter from an ex-hunter almostly exactly
> > echoes
> > > > the
> > > > > > sentiments laid out in the "Reasons/Excuses for Hunting and
> Fishing"
> > > > > thread.
> > > > > > My comments enclosed with **
> > > > >
> > > > > This [alleged] person became squeamish so now they buy their meat
at
> > > > Safeway
> > > > > so they don't have to kill animals for themselves. The next step,
> they
> > > > > beccome squeamish about that and become a vegetarian so they can
> > pretend
> > > > > that their food and lifestyle doesn't involve killing of animals
at
> > all.
> > > > > Then they can put up a website to make themselves feel important
by
> > > > > condemning unsqueamish people. No,it's not interesting at all,
it's
> a
> > > > tired
> > > > > old story.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > I'm not arguing either way,
> > >
> > > Really? Are you telling me that you're not sympathetic to his "journey
> > into
> > > compassion"?
> > >
> > >  however I do think you should have read the
> > > > article properly before commenting on it.
> > >
> > > I did read it, why would you assume I didn't?.
> > >
> >
> > Because your response was not in concordance wth the article:
> ==============
> Then neither did you.
>
>
> > 1) You said he now buys meat from Safeway, whereas the article says he
> >    is a vegetarian
> ====================
> He last killed an animal hunting in '92.  He still hunted until '97.  One
> would have to think that since he didn't kill anything for 5 years, he
must
> have been buying it for some time.
>

Yeh that does not really make sense to me, maybe 'hunted' is a misnomer as
he seems to suggest in the next paragraph that in the 5 years he was not
trying to kill anything. Or perhaps he was just a really crap hunter and
could
not even pop one off in 5 years.

>
>
> > 2) You said he pretends that his food and lifestyle does not involve the
> >    killing of animals at all, whereas the article stated that he
accepted
> >    that even as a vege he still kills animals
> =====================
> Yep, that's the earmark of the typical vegan.  Notice the 'animals' he
talks
> about are bugs.

He is providing one example of animals that he kills to prove the point,
you cannot interpret this as him saying that bugs on his truck grill are the
only animals he is taking responsibility for.

> I've never added bugs to the mix when I'm discussing animal
> death and suffering, but if that's what you want to do, I'm more than
> willing to add the billions of bugs crops kill to your total of
unnecessary
> animal death and suffering.
> Want to give it a go?
> Plus, he has no idea whether he's minimizing his impact or not.  You, and
> he, have never measured it to begin with.
>
>
> >
> > > > From the article:
> > > > -------------------------
> > > > Am I responsible for the death of animals, even though I am a
> > vegetarian,
> > > > don't use leather or fur? Sure. One only need observe the bugs on my
> > truck
> > > > grill to see that. But I have decided to minimize my impact on
animals
> > and
> > > > work to help them, rather than kill them.
> > >
> > > There's nothing in that article to indicate he is "minimizing" his
> impact
> > on
> > > animals, on the contrary, by substutiting store-bought, agribusiness
> plant
> > > based foods for that nutrient rich food he used to get by hunting has
> very
> > > likely increased his overall impact on animals. When you consider the
> > impact
> > > of pesticides, hebicides, loss of habitat, ploughing, harvesting,
> storage,
> > > etc.. his personal animal deaths per calorie quotient has almost
surely
> > > increased.
> > >
> > > > I have a lot of making up to do.
> > >
> > > As I said, his concern is all about his own sensibilities, not about
the
> > > animals.
> > >
> > > If you want my opinion, this article was faked by an animal rights
> > advocate,
> > > it has all the earmarks of their fallacious thinking.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>