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Re: Dispelling the "Man the Mighty Hunter" Myth



Rat & Swan wrote:
<snip blustery bullshit>

    From Library Journal
    This is one of a number of recent books that trace both
    environmental destruction and social oppression to the Western
    world view

Sentence should end there. Mason is a leftist prat whose anti-capitalist views make everything Western "wrong."

But an opposition to "the" (make that "a" or "various" ) Western world views is not necessarily anti-capitalist. Some of the worst ecological destruction has taken place in areas controlled by anti-capitalist regimes, such as the former Soviet territories. The worldview Mason means, I suspect, could better be described as a relic of the Victorian faith in progress and technology, and man's unique status above and outside the rest of nature.

Perhaps, but like other misanthropes from the Ivory Towers, Mason sees things only in stark terms of "East good, West bad" without much respect for the truth of either.


    that sets humankind outside of, above, and in conflict with
    nature.

It's not a exactly Western view,

It is A Western view -- a dominant one for a good two and a half centuries at least, with adherents going back to the Greek period.

Ipse dixit. Mason, like others, adopts a paradigm (that man and nature are in harmony) which many from the East reject. Like Western beliefs, Eastern beliefs consist of perfectionary goals which man often fails to attain for a variety of reasons -- hence reincarnation to try again and again, etc., prevalent in Eastern religion.


and it's corollary position (that everything Eastern is utopian and in accord with nature) is false.

That is not a necessary corollary, either.

It is in this instance.


There is more than one "Eastern" view as well.

Yes, Karen, I know. That's why I said "*everything* Eastern..."


Man's conflict with nature transcends culture and geography. The "paradigm of the primitive" is specious as well. The primitive hunts and gathers, and is often hunted himself.

I.e. -- primitive technology is less developed. That does not mean the worldview of "primitive" (which should be defined) peoples is less valuable than that of the more technologically developed cultures.

Luddite.


As C.S. Lewis put it, the pre-literate cultures which made the worst
pottery might have made the best poetry, and we would never know it.

Where did you get that quote? One of my favorite Lewis quotes: A silly idea is current that good people do not know what temptation means. This is an obvious lie. Only those who try to resist temptation know how strong it is... A man who gives in to temptation after five minutes simply does not know what it would have been like an hour later. That is why bad people, in one sense, know very little about badness. They have lived a sheltered life by always giving in.

I don't think Mason would trade in his laptop for life in the jungle. He's too conditioned by life in the Ivory Tower, and he'd have to endure the shattering of his mythic delusions.

    What makes this work unique is the emphasis he places on the
    relationship between human beings and other animals as both
    explaining and symbolizing our dysfunctional way of life with
    its built-in patriarchy, misogyny, and racism.


This sums up his book in a nutshell. Mason has co-written with Peter Singer, so you already know his AR background. What he spells out now is the rest of the effete views held by the radical elite today. One again, Mason upholds the mythical "paradigm of the primitive" while failing to note that women in such societies are literally barefoot and pregnant.

Men are usually barefoot, too.

But not pregnant.


As for pregnant: studies of tribes such
as the aboriginal tribes of Australia have shown that "primitive"
cultures do control fertility in various ways, such as prolonging the
period of nursing, which makes women less likely to become pregnant.
Most pre-industrial societies (if not all) also know about herbal
contraceptives and abortificants. Also, in pre-industrial societies,
with higher infant mortality, fertility is often good. Things are not
as simple as you make them out.

This strange digression of yours only shows you missed what I actually wrote.


Women's ability to produce new life often makes them figures of power in "primitive" tribes, where they
are more respected than in some "Western" cultures.

But do they have the right to vote, own land, or shoot their husbands?


    "Dominionism" justifies merciless exploitation of the earth and
    its creatures for human wealth and pleasure, but it has left a
    deep psychic wound.

The primitive, too, uses his surroundings to his advantage and exercises dominion in the jungle.

I question that he exercises "dominion."

You would question it, but only because you romanticize about jungle life -- it's consistent with your other pagan AR beliefs. Watch those shows on Discovery and National Geographic Channel: those folks are hunters. They kill animals, and sometimes they kill more than they plan to eat.


Other creatures represent the primitive's food and clothing, his sustenance in a rough environment. The "psychic wound" is only experienced in the West, and only by the hypersensitive and mentally ill ARAs and "ethical vegans."

It is experienced by many people in both Western and non-Western
cultures,

Ipse dixit.


including those who had been members of tribal or
non-Western cultures and who moved to a "Western" culture.

I know people who moved here from Nigeria, Ethiopia, and the Congo, not to mention from Central America. They're fine people who've adapted quite well to American life. I'll ask around to see if any of them are experiencing any "psychic wounds." I don't think they are, though.


The
sense of malaise is widespread today, among many groups.

You have Jimmy Carter to thank for that.


 I would
say very few people in the modern world are entirely comfortable
with the spiritually empty self-satisfaction of the worldview you
evidently advocate.

You're a fellow traveler of Mason so I'd expect you to find Western life "spiritually empty." Being "comfortable" about anything is very subjective. Here's how I see it. If I can't find spiritual richness right where I am in the space-time continuum, where will I ever find it?


How did St Paul put it? Look it up yourself. Philippians 4:10-13.

    In pursuing his argument Mason (coauthor with Peter Singer of
    Animal Factories , LJ 6/1/80) piles up powerful and provocative
    examples and insights.

No, it's mostly colorful sophistry, strawmen, and mythology masquerading as academic insight. His examples are specious, and his insights are flawed by illogic and the paradigm of the primitive.

ipse dixit -- some examples, please.

They were addressed above. Psychic wounds, racism, misogyny, etc., compared to animal "rights."


    He is less successful in convincing the reader of the
    sufficiency of his overall thesis...

Which supports my previous statement.

But is not necessarily true....

It definitely is in this case. I wouldn't expect you to know the difference, given that you have an agenda and you prefer Linzey and Hyland to Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.


The Library Journal review was on the Amazon website:
http://tinyurl.com/wetz




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