misbegotten god spot topic

How can you ask what it is that can fill that spot in our mind when you must
have already presented that spot to us?
Apart from needing or wanting to study the evolution of waffle and confusion
in learned texts, doesn't this bugger up the idea of needing or wanting to
hear any further considerations upon this misbegotten topic?
JJ

"Immortalist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> The God Spot
>
> We evolved with a "god spot," a desire and need to look toward something
> beyond us, something that can provide meaning and direction for our lives,
> our high and low experiences, and can help us understand and control what
> goes on in the world around us. With what do we fill that spot? I propose
in
> this series of lectures to explore how our forebears achieved this tens of
> thousands of years ago and how infants do so today. Such barely culturated
> experiences and beliefs teach about what the god that adequately fills the
> god spot must satisfy. The lectures continue by describing how
Christianity
> has, does, and might better fill this god spot in each of us.
>
> http://www.ksharpe.com/word/EP36.htm
>
> ----------------------------
>
> Believers from every tradition and around the world have reported similar
> sensations of religious experience - a feeling of completeness, absence of
> self, or oneness with the universe, feelings of peace, freedom from fear,
> ecstatic joy, visions of a Supreme Being.
>
> With the aid of new technology that allows them to watch the brain in
> action, a group of scientists - sometimes described as
"neurotheologists" -
> have tried to explain how such experiences occur and perhaps even why.
>
> "There are certain [brain] patterns that can be generated experimentally
> that will generate the sense, presence and the feeling of God-like
> experiences," says professor of Neuroscience Michael Persinger of
Ontario's
> Laurentia University. "The patterns we use are complex but they imitate
what
> the brain does normally."
>
> Persinger originally set out to explore the nature of creativity and sense
> of self. But his research into patterns of brain activity led him to delve
> into the nature of mystical experiences as well.
>
> To do this Persinger puts his subjects in a quiet room, depriving them of
> light and sound, so that the nerve cells typically involved in seeing and
> hearing are not stimulated. Then he applies a magnetic field pattern over
> the right hemisphere of the brain.
>
> Persinger was asked if his work leads him to conclude that "God," or the
> experience of God, is solely the creation of brain-wave activity.
>
> "My point of view is, 'Let's measure it.' Let's keep an open mind and
> realize maybe there is no God; maybe there might be," says Persinger.
"We're
> not going to answer it by arguments - we're going to answer it by
> measurement and understanding the areas of the brain that generate the
> experience and the patterns that experimentally produce it in the
> laboratory."
>
> Mind, Body and Belief
>
> To others who have thought deeply about religion, that is a conclusion
that
> far outstrips the evidence - a scientific leap of faith, if you will.
>
> "They have isolated one small aspect of religious experience and they are
> identifying that with the whole of religion," says John Haught, professor
of
> theology at Georgetown University.
>
> Religion "is not all meditative bliss. It also involves moments when you
> feel abandoned by God," says Haught. "It involves commitments and
suffering
> and struggle.. Religion is visiting widows and orphans; it is symbolism
and
> myth and story and much richer things."
>
> Persinger says he is less concerned with trying to prove or disprove the
> existence of God than with understanding and documenting the experience.
> However, in his view, "if we have to draw conclusions now, based upon the
> data, the answer would be more on the fact that there is no deity."
>
> He is clear about an underlying motivation of his work - a fear that
> unscrupulous people might use techniques to provoke a spiritual experience
> to control people.
>
> But Persinger also acknowledges a more positive possibility: "If you look
at
> the spontaneous cases of people who have God experiences and conversions,
> their health improves," he says. "So if we can understand the patterns of
> activity that generate this experience, we may also be able to understand
> how to have the brain - and hence the body - cure itself."
>
> What Prayer Does
>
> That search for the mind-body connection also motivates the work of other
> researchers, such as Professor Andrew Newberg at the University of
> Pennsylvania.
>
> "Whether there is a God or not in some senses isn't as relevant to the
kind
> of research we're doing so much as understanding why those feelings and
> experiences are important to us as human beings," he says.
>
> Newberg observed the brains of Tibetan Buddhists and Franciscan nuns as
they
> engaged in deep prayer and mediation by injecting radioactive dye, or
> "tracer" as the subject entered a deep meditative state, then
photographing
> the results with a high tech imaging camera. He found that "when people
> meditate they have significantly increased activity in the frontal area -
> the attention area of the brain - and decreased activity in that
orientation
> part of the brain."
>
> Many of these changes occur whether people are praying (focusing on
oneness
> with a deity) or meditating (focusing on oneness with the universe). But
> there are differences, in that prayer activates the "language center" in
the
> brain, while the "visual center" is engaged by meditation.
>
> Either way, Newberg finds that the sense of "unity," or "oneness"
> experienced by his subjects is a real, biological event. And he
acknowledges
> the limits of his own work: He currently lacks a means to measure the
> neurological events associated with other religious practices - such as
> caring for the poor or ecstatic worship.
>
> "Our work really points to the fact that these are very complex kinds of
> feelings and experiences that affect us on many different levels," says
> Newberg. "There is no one simple way of looking at these kinds of
> questions."
>
> Science and the Afterlife
>
> Across the country, at the University of Arizona, professor of Neurology
and
> Psychiatry Gary Schwartz would probably say: "Amen" to that.
>
> Perhaps the most controversial of the group of researchers dedicated to
> studying the "God spot" in the brain, Schwartz explores the question of
> whether consciousness survives death with the help of mediums (people who
> demonstrate unusual accuracy in describing intimate attributes of the dead
> to those who knew them well).
>
> His experiments compare the brain waves and heart rates of both the medium
> and the person for whom he or she is trying to contact the dead.
>
> "One of the fundamental questions is, 'How does a medium receive this kind
> of information?'" he explains. "To what extent are they using specific
> regions of the brain which are purportedly associated with other kinds of
> mystical or religious experiences?"
>
> Schwartz says his research "is actually a window or a doorway, if you
will,
> to a much larger spiritual reality which integrates ancient wisdom with
> contemporary science."
>
> He concludes that the human brain is wired to receive signals from what he
> calls a "Grand Organizing Design," or G.O.D.
>
> "Survival of conscience tells us that consciousness does not require a
> brain, that our memories, our intentions, our intelligence, our dreams?
all
> of that can exist outside of the physical body," says Schwartz. "Now, by
the
> way, that's the same idea that we have about God - that something that is
> "invisible," that is "bigger than all of us," which we cannot see, can
have
> intellect, creativity, intention, memory and can influence the universe."
>
> The Quest for Larger Things
>
> Like the other researchers interviewed for Nightline, Schwartz suggests
that
> his work has taken him on a personal spiritual journey, requiring him to
ask
> himself hard questions about science, faith, and reason. And Schwartz says
> that rather than diminishing faith, inquiries like his should enlarge the
> world's understanding of it.
>
> On that point, he and theologian John Haught agree.
>
> "Faith is the sense of being grasped by this higher dimension, or more
> comprehensive, or deeper reality," says Haught. "If we could come up with
> clear proof or an absolutely mathematically lucid proof or verification of
> deity, then that would not be deity - it would be something smaller than
> us.."
>
> http://tinyurl.com/wpob
>
> ----------------------------
>
> Scientists, philosophers and atheists have long argued that God and
> spirituality are constructs of the human mind, although that opinion
> generally hasn't been a popular one. After centuries of bloody holy wars
and
> fierce theological dispute, the controversy of the Creator's existence has
> taken a strange new turn: humanity may finally have uncovered tangible
> evidence that the phenomenon of religious faith is all in our heads.
>
> Literally.
>
> A group of neuroscientists at the University of California at San Diego
has
> identified a region of the human brain that appears to be linked to
thoughts
> of spiritual matters and prayer. Their findings tentatively suggest that
we
> as a species are genetically programmed to believe in God.
>
> The researchers came upon these cerebral revelations in the course of
> studying the brain patterns of certain people with epilepsy. Epileptics
who
> suffer a particular type of seizure are often intensely religious, and are
> known to report an unusual number of spiritually-oriented visions and
> obsessions. Measurements of electrical activity in the brains of test
> subjects indicated a specific neural center in the temporal lobe that
flared
> up at times when the subjects thought about God. This same area was also a
> common focal point overloaded with electrical discharges during their
> epileptic seizures.
>
> Could this heretofore unidentified part of the brain -- nicknamed the "God
> module" -- actually be some sort of physiological seat of religious
belief?
> The scientists who discovered it believe it might be. They have performed
a
> further study comparing epileptic subjects with different groups of
> non-epileptics -- a random group of average people, as well as individuals
> who characterized themselves as extremely religious. The electrical brain
> activity of the subjects was recorded while they were shown a series of
> words, and the God module zones of the epileptics and the religious group
> exhibited similar responses to words involving God and faith. No word yet
on
> whether the brains of atheists and agnostics might flatline the monitors,
> but the parallel results among the strong believers are considered
> impressive.
>
> "There may be dedicated neural machinery in the temporal lobes concerned
> with religion," the research team announced at a conference for the
Society
> for Neuroscience. "This may have evolved to impose order and stability on
> society."
>
> Anthropologists and Darwinian theorists have frequently speculated that
> religion may have developed as a self-policing mechanism as cooperation
with
> others became useful. With their intelligence and skills at making
weapons,
> there was little to stop early humans from slaughtering each other like
wild
> maniacs, until they began to fear unseen beings even bigger and badder
than
> themselves. This sort of adaptation has always been considered a purely
> psychological function, but now we have the first evidence that the
> religious instinct may be physically hard-wired right into our noggins.
>
> Which brings us to the most intriguing conundrum posed by the discovery of
> the God Spot. It's a double-edged sword shoved right through the heart of
> the science vs. religion debate, bearing either good news or bad news for
> the faithful masses depending on how you answer the chicken-or-the-egg
> question: does it mean that God created our brains, or that our brains
> created God?
>
> "These studies do not in any way negate the validity of religious
experience
> or God," the God module's discoverers took care to note, plainly
> anticipating a reception of fire and brimstone from certain quarters.
"They
> merely provide an explanation in terms of brain regions that may be
> involved."
>
> No matter how inconclusive or sketchy they label their findings as being,
> these scientists will inevitably be denounced as heathenistic blasphemers
> doing the work of Satan. Yet at the very same time, other equally devout
> worshipers will praise this discovery as a beautiful and wondrous epiphany
> that spells out God's great plan.
>
> So what'll it be? A sacred temple in the temporal lobes, or an incidental
> conflagration of the synapses? The Kingdom of Heaven confined to the
insides
> of our skulls, or "I think of God, therefore He is"? Touched in the head
by
> an angel, or brainwashed into belief by biology?
>
> Believe what you want, but either way, I think those who draw any serious
> mechanistic or teleological conclusions from this research ought to have
> their heads examined, as well.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/r3ik
>
> -------------------------------
>
> An article in Nov 17th, 2001 edition of New Scientist magazine claimed
that
> the prophet Ezekiel probably suffered from temporal lobe epilepsy. It
> maintains that many of the typical, tell-tale signs are there, such as
> fainting spells, temporary bouts of speechlessness, aggression, delusions,
> compulsive writing, and excessive religiousness.
>
> There is nothing particularly original about the New Scientist's claim.
For
> many years now, there has been a suspicion that people like St Paul, St.
> Joan of Arc, St. Teresa of Avila and Mohammed may have suffered from what
is
> sometimes referred to as the 'sacred disease.' It is also quite possible
> that, like them, Ezekiel was a victim of the same malady.
>
> In recent times, many neuroscientists have carried out brain research
which
> has tended to confirm that epilepsy and religiosity are often
> interconnected. For example, in 1998, Vilayanur Ramachandran, of San Diego
> University, published a book entitled, Phantoms in the Brain. In it he
> maintained that, following seizures, about 25 per cent of epileptics
report
> deeply moving spiritual experiences. They include a feeling of a divine
> presence and a sense of direct communication with God. Everything around
> them is imbued with cosmic significance. They may say, "I finally
understand
> what it is all about... Suddenly it all makes sense... I have insight into
> the true nature of the universe."
>
> As a result of examining the epileptics who report such significant
> religious experiences, Ramachandran and other researchers have suggested
> that there appears to be a "God spot" in the left temporal lobe of the
> brain. Briefly put, they suspect that epileptic seizures cause damage to
> some of the pathways which connect the area of the brain that deals with
> sensory information to the one that gives such information emotional
> significance. As a result, these patients can perceive an unusual depth of
> spiritual meaning in every object and event. Ramachandran goes on to ask a
> provocative question: if a surgeon removed a portion of the temporal lobe,
> would he be performing a "Godectomy"?
>
> http://www.redemptoristpublications.com/reality/sept02/godspot.html
>
> ----------------------------
>
> Seizures and the Sight of God
> Isabella Eguae-Obazee
> Researchers interested in the connection of the brain and religion have
> examined the experiences of people suffering from Temporal Lobe Epilepsy.
> Apparently the increased electrical activity in the brain resulting from
> seizure activity (abnormal electrical activity within localized portions
of
> the brain), makes sufferers more susceptible to having religious
experiences
> including visions of supernatural beings and near death experiences (NDEs)
> (9). Temporal Lobe Epilepsy (TLE) sufferers also may become increasingly
> obsessed with religion, the study and practice of it (1). Why is it that
> this form of epilepsy results in religious experiences among the other
> supernatural experiences possible? Can people who have never studied or
> practiced religion be susceptible to these same religious experiences? Why
> do some interested researchers claim that such notable figures as Paul on
> the road to Damascus, Joan of Arc, Ellen White of the Seventh-Day
Adventist
> Church and other persons suffered from TLE because of their range of
> reported experiences with God, angels, and demons (1,3)? In my first
paper,
> I highlighted the connection scientists have made between religious
> experience and the brain. In this paper, I intend to focus on Temporal
Lobe
> Epilepsy, as one of those connections, specifically the symptom of
> hyperreligiousity.
> In 1997 Vilayanur Ramachandran and his colleagues from the University of
> California at San Diego headed a research study. The team studied patients
> of temporal lobe epilepsy measuring galvanic skin response on the left
hands
> of the patients (11). This measurement allowed the research team to
monitor
> arousal (specific autonomic nervous system response) and indirectly
surmise
> the communication between the inferior temporal lobe and the amygdala,
both
> important in response related to fear and arousal (9). In addition to two
> control groups a religious control group and a non-religious control
group,
> each group was shown forty words, including violent words, sexual words,
and
> simple words (like "wheel"), and finally, religious-related words. The
> results of the study showed a greater arousal in the temporal lobe
epilepsy
> sufferers to religious words in comparison to the non-religious, whom were
> aroused by sexual words, and religious control groups, whom were aroused
by
> religious and sexual words (10).
>
> Ramachandran and his team concluded that although the patients were not
> experiencing seizures or experiencing supernatural occurrences at the time
> of testing, they were highly sensitive to religious words. Thus, the
> experiences of temporal lobe seizures strengthened the patients interest
in
> religion (11). Such a conclusion seems fairly reasonable considering that
> these patients also reported religious experiences during their seizures.
Is
> it possible that the increased arousal to religious words is not a direct
> result of their temporal lobe epilepsy, but rather a result of the
> supernatural experiences induced by their epilepsy? Possibly these
patients
> began to research and study religion more to finds ways to explain the
> experiences that they had during their seizures. Subsequent research on
very
> religious, non-epileptic subjects supports this idea. In a different
> experiment, the of very religious, non-epileptics' temporal lobes where
> noted to be more active (11). However, in epileptic patients, Ramachandran
> concludes that the seizure's damage to temporal lobe pathways makes these
> patients more sensitive to certain ideas that to others do not have great
> meaning; specifically, pathways that connect the part of the brain that
> gives recognizes to sensory information and the part that gives emotional
> meaning to the sensory information (4). Ramachandran believes that because
> of these specific damage, everything that these patients experience has
> great meaning (10).
>
> Some people, interested in proving God's inexistence, speculate that some
of
> the notable religious figures suffered from temporal lobe epilepsy. For
> example, they claim that Paul, a notable figure in Christianity had a
> temporal lobe seizure as he was walking toward Damascus (1). In the New
> Testament of the Bible, Paul claims to see God and hear Jesus Christ
> speaking to him. Other notable figures like Ellen Smith, of the
Seventh-day
> Adventist Church also claims to have had profound visions directly from
God.
> Contrary to these researchers belief, there are other components of
temporal
> epilepsy beyond hyperreligiousity that would negate these ideas.
Associated
> with temporal lobe epilepsy is also a change in personality. The person
may
> become irritable and obsessive-compulsive; they focus on extremely
abstract
> aspects of their daily life, and attach a great deal of importance to
daily
> situations. In addition they experience emotions with more intensity. With
> respect to these religious figures, the only one noted have any possible
> experience with epilepsy is Ellen White, an influential member of the
> Seventh Day Adventist Church. She suffered from a head injury during her
> childhood however the head injury was suffered near the nasal-area of her
> face (3). I found very little evidence to support the claims that her
among
> other religious figures suffered from TLE.
>
> From the studies completed on Temporal Epilepsy patients, it appears that
> hyperreligiousity may simply be a result of increased interest in the
> details and experiences of everyday life. However, the visions and other
> supernatural experiences reported by these patients gives cause for
> researchers to examine the temporal area of the brain. This portion of the
> brain may be what researchers are calling the "God Spot," a part of the
> brain where religion arises from (11). It is not clear why this would be
an
> ideal place for the so-called "God Spot." It is possible that the known
> functioning of the Temporal Lobe, recognizing sensory information and
> attributing meaning to sensory information is akin to the philosophies of
> religion. Maybe, the "God Spot" acquires its spot over time rather than
> having its presence in the brain early on in a human's life. If this were
> true, the next step would be to examine the Temporal Epilepsy cases of
> younger children. Do they also experience religion as older patients do?
>
> Furthermore, if possible researchers should examine the prior religious
> experiences and lives of temporal lobe epilepsy patients. Did they have
any
> interest in religion prior to their experiences with epilepsy? This may
> provide insight intensity and contents of the persons reported religious
> experiences. Hyperreligiousity is an interesting symptom of Temporal Lobe
> Epilepsy. The action of the temporal lobe after experiencing epileptic
> seizures supports the idea that religion might begin in the mind (10). I
> hope that within the coming years more scientists will research this
aspect
> of temporal lobe epilepsy. Thus, giving us more insight into whether the
> soul is within the brain.
>
> http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/bb/neuro/neuro01/web2/Eguae.html
>
> ----------------------------------
>
> 1)Epilepsy: Sacred Disease by Paul Newman
> http://stormloader.com/users/abrax7/epilepsy.htm
>
> 2)Yours, Mine, and Ours: Whose God is it, anyway?
> http://slate.msn.com/goodword/98-10-13/goodword.asp
>
> 3)Ellen G. White, by Don Hawley, Part 8
> http://www.sabbath.com/white/egw8.htm
>
> 4)BrainPlace.Com, Temporal Lobe
> http://www.brainplace.com/bp/brainsystem/temporal.asp
>
> 5)"The God Spot"
> http://www.parascope.com/articles/slips/fs22_3.htm
>
> 6)Brainstorms, A book review by Robert Finn
> http://nasw.org/finn/brnstrm.html
>
> 7)Personal Experience
> http://www.objectivethought.com/atheism/personalexperience.html
>
> 8)WebMD: Temporal Lobe Seizure
> http://my.webmd.com/content/asset/adam_disease_psychomotor_seizure
>
> 9)Touched by the Word of God
> http://www.newscientist.com/ns/971108/nreligion.html
>
> 10)Beliefnet
> http://tinyurl.com/wpnu
>
> 11)Genesis of Eden
> http://dhushara.tripod.com/book/rebirth/comment/scirel.htm
>
>