Re: Evidences of God

On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 13:28:26 GMT, "ZenIsWhen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Message ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in alt.atheism;

>
>"Chain Smoker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> "stoney" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > On Mon, 6 Oct 2003 22:00:07 +0200, "Chain Smoker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>> > Message ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in alt.atheism;
>> >
>> > >"stoney" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> > >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > >> On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 23:34:40 +0200, "Chain Smoker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>> > >> Message ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in alt.atheism;
>> > >>
>> > >> >"stoney" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> > >> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > >> >> On Sat, 4 Oct 2003 00:21:27 +0200, "Chain Smoker"
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>> > >> >> Message ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
>> alt.atheism;
>>
>> <much snipped>
>>
>> There is a lot in your response that was interesting to me, but I thought
>> I'd restrict this post to a smaller set of topic, particularly those not
>> snipped below.
>>
>> > >I believe God, the Father of Christ, supercedes any and all other
>things.
>> > >Christ's teachings seem to me the best thing I've ever encountered.  I
>> > >think, even if a person thought he was not the Son of God, that they
>> should
>> > >appreciate him for those.
>> >
>> > The teachings didn't originate with Christianity.
>>
>> Where did they originate?  This issue has come up in other discussions
>I've
>> read and participated in on Usenet, but I've never seen specifics.  I've
>> seen claims that Mithraism and (I think) Zoroastrianism are the sources of
>> Christian beliefs such as virgin birth, water baptism, salvation by proxy,
>> resurrection.  But none of these are specifically taught by Christ except
>> water baptism.  The rest are said about Christ, but that's another thing
>> entirely.
>>
>> Christ's teachings include, among other things, that we should love even
>our
>> enemies, that we should not judge one another (often misinterpreted to
>mean
>> that we should not try and point out one another's mistakes for
>correction),
>
>"Misinterpreted"?
>Yes - misinterpreted by the zealots who defy the instrctions AND play judge
>and jury on others.
>
>Just what the hell, in your delusional justifications,do you  THINK "you
>should not judge another" means?

Ummm....I don't think Chain Smoker deserves a hefty barrage.  The shift
in mindset involved with discussing theistic concepts, ramifications,
and reprecussion can be wrenching and doesn't happen overnight.

>> and that we should not pray or fast in a manner that broadcasts our piety
>> for recognition and reward by our fellows.
>
>If you pray and fast - that is your business.
>Praying and fgasting does not broadcast piety - it only shows that you are
>religous. To people who aren't religious, they see it as foolish.
>If you are looking for rewards for it - that is your ego - NOT anyting to do
>with following christ!
>
>  This last item, you included in
>> part of the text I snipped, and is among my favorite passages in the
>> Gospels.  I have not seen specifics about where Christ supposedly derived
>> these teachings if he did not come up with them independently.  If you
>know
>> where, please, do tell.
>
>The point is not whether christ originated the concepts or not - it is
>outrageous that christian believers claim and ACT like he originated them!

Is it really 'outrageous?'  Generally, theists are spoon fed it was from
birth.  I think he should be cheered in his efforts.

>The laws under the ten commandments are certainly NOT original - but many
>zealots, who wish to parade them around in public places, ACT like there
>were no laws like this until they appeared int eh bible!
>
>Like many other frauds, you act as though the claims you are arguing against
>were original - but, in fact, they were responses to claims made by
>extremist zealots.

I think the accusation of fraud is uncalled for.  He's aware of people
indicating the claims are not original and he's looking for information.
Neither is he insisting others pay attention to or give credulence to
his religion.

IMO, he's trying very hard to get informational updates/searching for
information without insisting the tenets of his religion applies to
others.

(snip)
         

   
             Stoney
"Designated Rascal and Rapscallion
               and
          SCAMPERMEISTER!"

When in doubt, SCAMPER about!
When things are fair, SCAMPER everywhere!
When things are rough, can't SCAMPER enough!
/end humour alert

alt.atheism military veteran #11
{so much for the 'no atheists in foxholes' rubbish}