Re: near iron deficiency / hepatitis

"doe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Subject: Re: near iron deficiency / hepatitis
> >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  (doe)
> >Date: 9/1/2003 12:53 PM Mountain Daylight Time
> >Message-id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> >>Subject: Re: near iron deficiency / hepatitis
> >>From: "Manky Badger" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>Date: 9/1/2003 8:23 AM Mountain Daylight Time
> >>Message-id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>
> >>
> >>"doe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>> >Subject: Re: near iron deficiency / hepatitis
> >>> >From: "Manky Badger" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >>> >Date: 8/31/2003 7:51 AM Mountain Daylight Time
> >>
> >>> >Would you advocate a meat diet ?
> >>>
> >>> I believe you already know the answer to that one ..
> >>>
> >>> >Would you recommend a vegetarian diet ?
> >>>
> >>> I believe you already know the answer to that one .
> >>
> >>Then why not abandon the sarcasm & ebter into the spirit of discuusion
by
> >>giving a clear, supported answer.
> >>
> >>>
> >>> >Or is it that you don't know that there are certain foods which
despite
> >>> >being high in iron content contain other substances that prevent iron
> >>> >absorbtion ?
> >>>
> >>> a-b-s-o-r-P-t-i-o-n
> >>>
> >>> If you require iron their ain't no oxalate in the world which is going
to
> >>> prevent your body from absorbing .. it ..
> >>
> >>Really - this would contradict most current theories.
> >
> >PLENTY of studies which confirm the above ..
> >
> >When one uses ARTIFICIALLY high markers to assess 'anemia' .. then
chances
> >are
> >you are going to get ARTIFICIALLY high numbers of people considered to be
..
> >anemic.
> >
> >"All those anemic vegetarians.. "
> >
> >http://www.llu.edu/llu/vegetarian/iron.htm
> >
>
> This study shows even though these people aren't considered to be iron
> overloaded ACCORDING TO PARAMETERS SET BY THE MEDICAL PROFESSION .. the
> reduction of the iron levels led to a 40% drop ..
>
> So logic would say ..something ain't right in Denmark ..
>
>
> 1: Gastroenterology 2002 Apr;122(4):931-9 Related Articles, Links
>
>
> Effect of iron depletion in carbohydrate-intolerant patients with clinical
> evidence of nonalcoholic fatty liver disease.
>
> Facchini FS, Hua NW, Stoohs RA.
>
> Department of Medicine, University of California San Francisco and San
> Francisco General Hospital, San Francisco, California, USA.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> BACKGROUND & AIMS: Increased body iron, genetic hemochromatosis (GH)
mutations,
> and nonalcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD) tend to cluster in
> carbohydrate-intolerant patients. In an attempt to further clarify the
> interrelationships among these conditions, we studied 42
> carbohydrate-intolerant patients who were free of the common GH mutations
C282Y
> and H63D, and had a serum iron saturation lower than 50%. METHODS: We
measured
> body iron stores, and induced iron depletion to a level of near-iron
deficiency
> (NID) by quantitative phlebotomy. RESULTS: In the 17 patients with
clinical
> evidence of NAFLD, we could not demonstrate supranormal levels of body
iron
> (1.6 +/- 0.2 vs. 1.4 +/- 0.2 g; P = 0.06). However, at NID, there was a
40%-55%
> improvement (P = 0.05-0.0001) of both fasting and glucose-stimulated
plasma
> insulin concentrations, and near-normalization of serum alanine
> aminotransferase activity (from 61 +/- 5 to 32 +/- 2 IU/L; P < 0.001).
> CONCLUSIONS: These results reflect the insulin-sparing effect of iron
depletion
> and indicate a key role of iron and hyperinsulinemia in the pathogenesis
of
> NAFLD.
>
> PMID: 11910345 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
>
> ---------------------------------------------------
>
> Another study found by lowering iron levels into the state COMMONLY FOUND
IN
> PREMENOPAUSAL WOMEN .. led to dramatic improvement ... again showing
therefore
> .. the 'state' commonly found in premenopausal women .. might not be all
that
> bad .. ?
>
> I suppose since almost 20% of premenopausal women are considered to be
anemic
> .. then maybe the marker used to diagnose 'anemia' in women is actually
set too
> high ..
>
> <<snip>>
> Thus, although individuals
> at high risk for ASCVD are not Fe-overloaded, they seem to benefit,
> metabolically and hemodynamically, from lowering of body Fe to levels
commonly
> seen in premenopausal females.
> <<snip>>
>
> Ann N Y Acad Sci 2002 Jun;967:342-351
>
>
>
> Effect of Iron Depletion on Cardiovascular Risk Factors: Studies in
> Carbohydrate-Intolerant Patients.
>
> Facchini FS, Saylor KL
> Department of Medicine, Division of Nephrology, San Francisco General
Hospital
> and University of California, San Francisco, California, USA.
>
> [Record supplied by publisher]
>
>
> Controversy surrounds the role of iron (Fe) in atherosclerosis (ASCVD),
mainly
> due to the inaccuracy of assessing body Fe stores with serum ferritin and
> transferrin saturation. Quantitative phlebotomy was used to test whether
or not
> (a) Fe stores are increased in individuals at high risk for ASCVD and (b)
Fe
> depletion to near-deficiency (NID) levels is associated with reduction of
risk
> factors for ASCVD. Thirty-one carbohydrate-intolerant subjects completed
the
> study. Fe stores were within normal limits (1.5 +/- 0.1 g). At NID, a
> significant increase of HDL-cholesterol (p < 0.001) and reductions of
blood
> pressure (p < 0.001), total and LDL-cholesterol (p < 0.001), triglyceride
(p <
> 0.001), fibrinogen (p < 0.001) and glucose and insulin responses to oral
> glucose loading (p < 0.001) were noted, while homocysteine plasma
concentration
> remained unchanged. These effects were largely reversed by a 6-month
period of
> Fe repletion with reinstitution of Fe sufficiency. Thus, although
individuals
> at high risk for ASCVD are not Fe-overloaded, they seem to benefit,
> metabolically and hemodynamically, from lowering of body Fe to levels
commonly
> seen in premenopausal females.
>
> PMID: 12079862
>

That's the idea - reasoned argument rather than bitter sarcasm.

Now you posted

"When one uses ARTIFICIALLY high markers to assess 'anemia' .. then chances
are you are going to get ARTIFICIALLY high numbers of people considered to
be anemic."

What has that to do with the absorbtion of food groups ?