Re: particles and the transitivity of verbs

"mario dias" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> i was wondering if we could establish a rule for the use of particles
> describing the direct object (what) or the indirect object (who),
> according to the verb being transitive or intransitive.

I am not aware of any easy to remember rule.

> let me try to explain myself with examples.
> some of these sentences are surely wrong but i had to put them to get
> the full idea on if was there a difference in particle usage depending
> on the verb being transitive or not.
>
>
> a) (what) and a transitive verb:
>
>  i choose this book - watashi wa kono hon wo erabu

Let me see if I can pick which sentences you wrote are grammatically
correct.  It will be a fun game that hopefully somebody who really knows
Japanese can check me on.  I say the above one is OK.

>  i choose this book - watashi wa kono hon ga erabu
Wrong (so I guess, anyway).

>  i choose this book - watashi ga kono hon wo erabu
OK, although different in nuance from the earlier correct sentence.

>  i choose this book - watashi ga kono hon ga erabu
Wrong.

>  i include john - watashi wa john wo fukumeru
OK.

>  i include john - watashi wa john ga fukumeru
> (the sentence above gives me the idea that it's john who is including
> me, not the other way around)
I think you are right here.  watashi wo john ga fukumeru would also be
possible in such case, though (not as constrastive as with wa, thought).

>  i include john - watashi ga john wo fukumeru
OK.  Emphasizes that watashi is doing the fukumering and not somebody else.

>  i include john - watashi ga john ga fukumeru
Wrong.  Having two nominal "ga"s in a sentence is usually wrong, AFAIK.

> c) (what) and an intransitive verb:
>
>  i need a drink - watashi wa nomimono wo iru
You picked a (somewhat) unusual example.  "iru" always takes ga for what in
English would be its direct object.

>  i need a drink - watashi wa nomimono ga iru
OK.

>  i need a drink - watashi ga nomimono wo iru
Wrong.

>  i need a drink - watashi ga nomimono ga iru
Weird because of the two "ga"s.  See above.

> d) (who) and an intransitive verb:
>
>  i apologize to john - watashi wa/ga john ni ayamaru
OK.

>  i met with john - watashi wa/ga john to aimashita
OK.

> can anyone help me? and sorry for all the watashis

What is your question?  In general, what in English is a direct object may
not be so in Japanese.  Each verb handles things differently.  If you are
just asking if you have the general, broad-strokes ideas about the particles
wa, ga, wo, and ni right, I guess you kind of do.

Note: My Japanese is terrible.  Please weight the advise of those more
qualified much more heavily than mine.

-- 
Curt Fischer