Re: Language tree rooted in Turkey

"Seppo Renfors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> Diarmid Logan wrote:
> >
> > http://www.nature.com/nsu/031124/031124-6.html
> >
> > Language tree rooted in Turkey
> >
> > Evolutionary ideas give farmers credit for Indo-European tongues.
> >
> > 27 November 2003
> >
> > JOHN WHITFIELD
> >
> > A family tree of Indo-European languages suggests they began to spread
> > and split about 9,000 years ago. The finding hints that farmers in
> > what is now Turkey drove the language boom - and not later Siberian
> > horsemen, as some linguists reckon.
>
> I have just finished tearing this drivel to pieces elsewhere already.
> Just look at the nonsense above "Siberian horsemen". They do have and
> did have Reindeer, but they are hard to confuse with horses.

So we are both in agreement that the Kurgans did not exist then. They are
just the fictional creation of a bunch of ignorant linguists and the Hittite
explanation makes the most sense.

>
> [snip rubbish]
>
> > All other Indo-European languages split off from Hittite, the oldest
> > recorded member of the group, between 8,000 and 10,000 years ago, the
> > pair calculates.
>
> Languages aren't exactly stable. They are prone to change - the rate
> of change vary greatly. It very often depends on external matters to
> the people using the language. It can be geological activity (earth
> quakes, volcanos causing a people movement), drought, immigrants -
> emigration and even a return of people. How can anyone factor in these
> unrelated, at times chance events? They cannot even know that the area
> contained the same people that long ago as they claim - those that

Actually they CAN. DNA research combined with archaeology has proven the
locations of the migrations of each of the 10 ycDNA lineages which make up
the European populations as far back as 130,000 years ago.

> spoke Hittite.

WRONG. The DNA and archaeological evidence shows that the only common
lineages to both Greece, Anatolia and Iran is M172 and M35. There is NO
TRACE of M173 in Persia and M35 is an Afro-Asiatic (so called Semitic)
linage.

> Lets face it, there are a number of languages that use
> the Hittite hieroglyphs to write their text, including Mitanni, Luwian
> etc. This shows a contact with people of different languages existed.

And all these populations had the M172 linage in common.

>
> > Around this time, farming techniques began to spread out of Anatolia -
> > now Turkey - across Europe and Asia, archaeological evidence shows.
> > The farmers themselves may have moved, or natives may have adopted
> > words along with agricultural technology.
>
> The obvious here is that first it had to ARRIVE IN Anatolia before it
> could move from there. If the notion "agriculture spreads the
> language" is used as "argument", that agriculture = IE language, then
> the language should NOT be Hittite, as agriculture originates from
> Afro-Asiatic language areas. The "theory" fails for that reason alone.

WRONG.

Agriculture and civilisation (city building) has been shown to originate
from Mesopotamia over 20,000 years ago and NOT Africa.

The DNA evidence shows that the M172 and M170 lineages split from the M89
linage 80,000 years ago therefore the German and Greco-Hittite-Iranian must
have split from Phoenician at the same time. In fact there is every
likelihood that the so-called Semitic elements of Phoenicians were
introduced into it by the M35 linage 20,000 years ago migrating into
Mesopotamia and splitting the Greco-Hittite, Germanic, and Iranian
populations apart.

>
> > Some linguists believe that Kurgan horsemen carried them out of central
Asia 6,000 years ago.
>
> I can assure these people than a particular type GRAVE does NOT ride
> horses - it is a 100% guarantee!
>
> [..]
> --
> SIR - Philosopher unauthorised
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> The one who is educated from the wrong books is not educated, he is
> misled.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------