Re: The Vinland Map Find Or Fraud?

On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 22:03:28 -0000, "Vaughan Sanders"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>
>"Eric Stevens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> On Mon, 1 Dec 2003 11:43:58 -0000, "Vaughan Sanders"
>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>snip
>
>> I have been sailing for 60 years and have many miles of saltwalter
>> under my belt (there is a mixed metaphor if there was one!). These
>> days I rely on two engines.
>>
>> If you consult reference works such as the 'Admiralty Sailing
>> Directions' or Cornell's 'World Sailing Routes' you will see that
>> first, there is a reverse current in the north of the Atlantic which
>> takes ships from the north of England round through the Faroes,
>> Iceland, Greenland to Newfoundland. Similarly, by sailing well to the
>> north it is possible to pick up the easterly winds on the north side
>> of the westward moving depressions. By keeping to the north one gets
>> both favourable winds and currents for a journey to the west.
>>
>> A more southerly route meets both winds and currents from the west,
>> which is why they would have returned that way.
>
>Well Eric, if I was a Basque and had just taken your advice to put 2000
>miles on my journey.
>I would be severely pissed.
>(current shipping forecast)
>WEST FAEROES SOUTHEAST ICELAND
>SOUTH OR SOUTHWEST 3 OR 4, OCCASIONALLY 5, INCREASING 5 TO 7,
>PERHAPS GALE 8 LATER. RAIN LATER. GOOD BECOMING MODERATE
>
>(southerly route)
>FITZROY SOLE
>NORTH OR NORTHWEST 5 TO 7, OCCASIONALLY GALE 8. THUNDERY SHOWERS OR
>RAIN. GOOD OCCASIONALLY MODERATE

Its lovely to have consistent weather - the same forecast every day.
Its cheaper too. You can close down the meteorological department.

In any case, they would not have been making the voyage as the depth
of winter approaches (as is the case at present). They would have
sailed in the middle of the year when the weather pattern was further
south.

>
>
>>
>> >I can see no reason why the Basques would have to go north to cross
>the
>> >Atlantic, there's no trade wind pattern in the north. The direction
>of
>> >the wind is controlled by the pressure systems that track up from the
>> >south, i.e.. anti-clockwise (low), clockwise (high).
>>
>> You are quite right about the pressure systems. The lows rotate
>> anti-clockwise while generally moving eastward at 15 to 30 knots. That
>> means anyone sailing west on a course to the south of the depressions
>> would be facing westerly gales. A course to the north of the
>> depressions usually means that one is sailing in moderate easterly
>> winds.
>
>You do understand it's the Low that is moving at up to 30 knots?. you
>can't stay to the north unless you head in the same direction at 30
>knots.

Quite right. I already said so.

>North eastward is the usual direction, sailing west the bulk of the wind
>you would be sailing in is favourable (presuming you are not just
>clipping the edge), easterly as you say, then *Backing* to the south,
>then westerly eventually petering out to the north west. If the low was
>to stop moving when I had a westerly head wind, I would put her on the
>starboard tack (north) and head for the southerly that I know is there.
>If it was still moving I would keep her on the port tack (south) and as
>the wind backed to the north I would be coming back on course.

I suspect you are located in the south of England, in fact you are,
secretary of the Chalkwell wind surfing club I see, located near
South-end on Sea. Travel a few hundred miles north and your experience
of the weather will be quite different.

I suggest you consult the Admiralty Sailing Directions or similar.
>
>> >
>> >They may have gone south to pick up the Roaring Forties (westerly)
>for
>> >the return trip, ...
>>
>> I very much doubt it.    :-)
>>
>> See http://www.bartleby.com/65/ro/roaringf.html
>>
>>   "name applied, especially by sailors, to the latitudes between 40°S
>>    and 50°S, where the prevailing westerly winds are strong and
>>    steady. Unlike the winds in the Northern Hemisphere, those in the
>>    roaring forties are not impeded by large land areas"
>
>You have misunderstood this, the roaring forties apply to both
>latitudes, just not as reliable in the northern hemisphere because of
>the land masses.

You slipped. It would be better to acknowledge a simple mistake rather
than try to flannel your way out of it.
>
>>
>> > ...  above 40 degrees Lat, the northern land masses break up
>> >the Trade patterns and the only wind is from the low pressures,
>(highs
>> >give only light breezes). If you are lucky you can get a high to the
>> >north and low to the south that stick, between the two is a nice
>> >easterly.
>> >A lee shore is a no no to a sailing ship, the land itself creates the
>> >wind that makes it a lee shore.
>>
>> Only on a fine calm day when a 'land breeze' arises.
>
>Well I grant you it has to be hot, but if the prevailing wind is in the
>same direction the strength can double, opposite direction and they can
>cancel each other out.

Sounds like coastal or harbour sailing to me. [1} If you watched the
America's Cup races in New Zealand on TV you could see it variously
happening or not happening every day.

[1.  It was at this point I decied to find out where Chalkwell was
located.  ]

http://www.chalkwell-windsurfing.fsnet.co.uk/j-fpage.html

There you are in all your glory and not a lifejacket in sight.   :-(



Eric Stevens