Re: PH issue

Thanks!
Why do use RO in the first place? Plants do NOT need RO nor do they do
> better in RO/softer water.
 I have plants that are flourishing in soft water which I was never able to
grow in a non mixed tap water.....
I agree that tap water are ok for plants but my problem is trying to
maintain an Amazon biotope.... which most off the plants/fish require soft
water,
What I do is mixing 1/4 tap water with 3/4 RO water which gives me an output
of soft water and about a PH of 6.8  -  Which will last shortly...
Anyway my Cardinals Tetra and Discuss are doing well and So are the plants.
Yes you might say I m am more tending to be a plant Fanatic... and the tank
is a 100 gallon with 4 florescent tubes + 2 of Hagen A-7695 CO2 Natural
Plant System - I do agree that the CO2 could be insufficient. Some plants as
I have read would do better in a PH range of 6.5-7 than in higher....
Maybe this is a lack of CO2.....
Thanks again

gizmo


"[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
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> "Racf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
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> > "gizmo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
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> > > Well what makes me curious is that just a Day after Changing the water
> >  the
> > > PH raises....
> > > I m still looking for factors that might effect the buffering
> >  issue..... I
> > > came over the hardness issue due to the RO system and this is one good
> > > thing.
> > > The only problem is tying to maintain  a PH value of 6.8-7.0 (I m
> > > optimistic.....)
> > > I do have 4 tanks which in all I have about the same GH and almost the
> >  same
> > > PH (7.2-7.4)
> > > In my planted one I use a CO2 system and its fully planted with not
> >  many
> > > fish.....
> > > Maybe I 'm missing something about the buffering but are there other
> > > parameters I might look for ?
> > > 10x again
>
> Why do use RO in the first place? Plants do NOT need RO nor do they do
> better in RO/softer water.
>
> > If you pH is rising, the kH is rising.
>
> Well, removing the acid, in this case the CO2 by the plants, will
> cause the pH to rise also. After the lights go off, the pH should drop
> back down. This cycle will repeat daily. Unless there's enough CO2
> being supplied, this is also could be the issue. pH is generally very
> stable in a well run planted tank, but adding enough CO2 is the key.
>
>  > In a lot of my tanks I use only RO water.  I add tiny amounts of
> Calcium
> > Sulfate, Calcium Chloride, and Magnesium Sulfate to insure some
> > electrolytes.  I adjust my pH with plain Baking Soda.  My pH ranges from
> > 4.0 - 6.0.  Maintaining a precise value has never been my desire.
>
> Amen.
>
> > RO water has no hardness or buffering.  Taking a pH reading is rather
> > tricky on it.  My $75 pH meter tends to read it rather closely to
> > whatever the pH of the solution I calibrated to.  If I calibrate to 4.0,
> > I tend to get levels just above it.  If I calibrate to 7.0, it follows
> > this closely.  Its hard to read since the probe has an influence on it.
> > The precision of my meter is specified to be .2, which means its not
> > pinpoint accurate.  The accuracy is very limited and is easily
> > compromised.  I understand its short comings and really would not worry
> > over even a .5 discrepancy.  It clearly is most trusted immediately
> > after a calibration with a solution close to what I intend to measure.
> > I would probably spend a couple hundred dollars on a better and more
> > accurate model if I felt that pH was such a vital parameter, but I do
> > not believe it is.  My meter is better than a color change test kit and
> > that's about it.
>
> Your problem lies in the super soft water for testing the pH. Pure
> water pH probes require specialized pH probes, there is no buffer in
> the solution(pure waters). Many reading from very soft water readings
> have been found to be in error over the years as many have assumed
> these common pH probes are able to accurately measure pH in super
> soft/pure waters. I have a very nice ion meter and a nice selection of
> probes. But for what you do, the TDS meter works well.
>
> > After mixing water sources it may take a while before the pH is stable
> > especially in low buffer environments.  RO water will generally take on
> > the characteristics of the environment its added to, since it has no
> > buffer.  It will dilute the gH and kH, but cannot really affect the pH
> > directly beyond the dilution affects.
>
> Same came be said about pH for tap water and water changes.
>
> > Not sure why you want your pH to be precisely 6.8 - 7.0 all the time?
> > That would be really tough to do without adding some type of pH
> > regulating goop into your tank.  Fish are certainly not so picky that
> > such a precise value is required.  Some folks are lucky in that their
> > tap water is at a value deemed perfect so that plain Water changes are
> > all that is necessary for maintaining a specific value.  If my desired
> > pH was 8.2 - 8.4, I personally would have it made.
>
> Fully planted tank folks often get told that plants prefer a certain
> pH range. So they obsess about pH rather than figuring out how to add
> enough CO2 gas. It's all about the CO2 and having enough/slight
> excess. pH + KH will give the CO2 reading. Removing all the KH as
> mentioned will cause problems. 3-5KH/GH is good, don't go less than
> about 2-3KH and 3 for GH.
>
> Discus/Angels etc breed fine at a KH/GH of 3-5, so while a breeding
> operation might get higher yields with softer water, bare bottom tanks
> etc, planted tanks do quite well and look 1000% better. Healthy
> plants= healthy fish.
> Generally if you are not keeping specialized fish and breeding them
> etc, tap water is fine, even if as hard as can be, examples: KH 15/GH
> 25 etc.
> My plants do quite well. They also do the same in soft water KH 3/GH
> 5.
> But the CO2 level is the same in both tanks/nutrients routine etc.
> Read up on pH/KH/CO2 on the web.
>
> Regards,
> Tom Barr