Re: Switching from growers to layers

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Jill 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
> "Krys Francis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Jill
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
> > I'm curious about this. I'm not particularly knowledgeable about poultry
> > nutrition but many of the long time breeders who can't obtain breeder
> > pellets say that they use growers (without coccidiostats) plus offer
> > calcified seaweed & grit. I realise that Speckledies aren't going to be
> > breeders but I had the impression that the most important differences
> > were higher vitamins & protein in grower, higher calcium & minerals in
> > layers.
> > Come on then give us an in depth lesson in poultry nutrition:-))
> :~))
> no indepth lesson - I don't have time just now to find the references I have
> read about the various nutritional differences and uses of the two
> but there is just simplicity  ----
> Layers ration is formulated to be optimum for laying hens - both those
> coming into lay and while laying and most especially those that are
> commercially bred.

To push them into giving the optimum number of eggs in their first year 
& then they kill them? Other considerations would presumably not be of 
any concern to the commercials since the birds which they are interested 
in don't need to live very long?
Don't know how much relevance life expectancy has regarding nutrition.

> Growers is to optimize the stage before that
> I would guess there is a dovetailing of the needs of the commercial bird and
> the breeding of commercial types to the feeds available - feed optimization
> is one of the most critical guides in the development of the commercial
> hybrids.
>
> As you say breeders can have different requirements - you are working on
> fertility and eggs as young chick potential.
> Often the birds will be older - well certainly in older times no self
> respecting breeder bred from pullets to produce good breeding pullets. [a
> major reason was that you knew too little about their abilities]

But what would the pullets have been fed? They would still have been 
laying eggs during their first year.

> So their requirements are different
> - in old days it would not be so much growers pellets but meat and bone meal
> and other such additives they still had the use of [but that is going back
> to the hey days - 1920-30's]
> The feed manufacturers - in the main - spend a lot of time and money on
> optimising the rations for the different stages
> If growers was designed for commercial layers - it would be called layers
> not growers
>
> Hence why I answered for the situation presented
>
> - an owner of commercial hybrids kept for laying moving from the growers
> stage into the layers stage

Not as technical as I was hoping for. Not convinced that, if offered 
extra calcium & minerals, it would make much difference for the domestic 
producer.

I've found some possibly interesting info on nutrition in a 1950's 
utility poultry book. Looks like I'll have to try to learn a bit for 
myself:-(
Trouble is I'm not sure how much I can trust the feed info in this old 
book.... some of the diets include barley!!
> --
> regards
> Jill Bowis
> new for Christmas http://www.animalgiftshop.co.uk - hand quilted cushions
> Pure bred utility chickens and ducks; Housing; Books
> Herbaceous; Herb and Alpine nursery
> Holidays in Scotland and Wales
> http://www.kintaline.co.uk

--

Regards


Krys
www.lluestfarmpoultry.co.uk