Re: Utility of anarch cards

> Your mantra is crappy... for a competetive environment at least. I
> don't have too much fun always falling flat on my face because I'm
> spending actions for mediocre benefits... I'd rather govern down or
> bleed!

Blood Doll, Minion Tap are not the be-all and end-all of tournament winning
decks. Nobody refutes their power, but I think this game is just a LITTLE
bit more diverse than having to include any of those 3 cards in a tournament
deck to be competitive.

And maybe, just maybe, Governing down or bleeing with Govern has been done
once or twice before? Maybe, just maybe mind you, some players like to have
the challenge of finding new ways to win without the aid of dominate? Just a
thought....

>
> > What? Are anarch decks mentioned in the sentence you just quoted? It was
> > about Ravnos voting. You can't see but anarch boogies in this thread,
> > can you?
>
> OK, yes, I can't see anything but anarch boogies in this thread. NO
> one has yet to tell me how THE MOLE can be a good enough card to play,
> when I have to GO ANARCH somehow. Compare to second tradition. If
> something isn't as good as that, or if there's nothing that this
> mechanic can't do that a prince or justicar can't, I won't bother.
> Heck, it's easier and more benefitial to GO JUSTICAR with mono-clan
> weenie decks! Christ...

How on earth can you compare 2nd Tradition to The Mole? Apples and oranges
here, bub. Why don't you run off and check how many non-titled vampires
there are with some version of animalism and/or celerity and/or dominate and
compare that with that amount of Camarilla vampires that can call a Praxis
Seizure *and* pass the vote. There is NO trifle master that turns a
Camarilla vampire into a prince/justicar; there is NO generic action to
become a prince/jusitcar; there is NO straight-action card that untaps you
after you complete it to become a prince/justicar; there is NO unique
permanent master that you can tap to make one of your vampires a
prince/justicar.

And the versatility of 2nd Tradition isn't even anywhere NEAR the
versatility of The Mole. Not only are all the discipline-effects on The Mole
incredibly effective for their field, but there has never been a better
incentive for my predator's minions to waste time, blood and actions that
will give him no benefit than

Not to mention your assertion that: "If something isn't as good as that, or
if there's nothing that this mechanic can't do that a prince or justicar
can't, I won't bother." is just ludicrous. Please point me out to a prince
with dominate that can just CANCEL a weenie bleed in it's tracks?

And hey, if you want focus, maybe try out getting a few animalism weenies,
go anarch with them, get some raven spies, and then use the ani version of
The Mole to untap and block? I'd go almost as far as saying that's even
better than 2nd Tradition in terms of blocking power, as the only blood you
have spent is for permanent intercept that doesn't go away.



> > I get a distinct feeling that keeping your head in the box of imagined
> > goal of efficiency you can keep chanting the same mantras all over again
> > without bringing anything new to the subject.
>
> Oh, my goal efficiency is NOT imagined. And I would LOVE to be able to
> chant the mantra "Going anarch is better than govern. Going anarch is
> better than princes. Going anarch is better than better", but I just
> feel like I'm lying to myself everytime I do so.

Why does it have to be better? Why can't it just be different? And hey,
crazy as it sounds, you can still use Govern while you're an anarch!
AMAZING! Except now you have access to the amazing toolbox of effects that
anarchs have available to them.

[snip rest of bitching about cards that make anarchs worth while]