Re: Do CHUMPS share responsibility?

"Iain Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> "tjmc" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > As CART struggles in its final throes of death, I've got a serious
> > question.  To what extent, if any, are its supporters responsible for
> > its demise?
> >
> > In spite of CART taking a serious blow in 1996, the series, aided
> > tremendously by Team Target/Ganassi and the greatness of Alex Zanardi,
> > managed to deliver great racing for the next several seasons.  But even
> > by then the CHUMPS had lined up in an us-against-them mentality.
> >
> > This mentality meant that it was unwise to criticize the organization at
> > any turn.  Any criticism somehow meant weakness vis-a-vis the IRL and
> > Tony George.  Moreover, not only was criticism virtually banned, the
> > moves CART made, no matter how terrible, were to be cheered and
> > applauded by the party faithful.
> >
> > I can't remember the exact chronology but moves such as the IPO; the
> > scheduling of horrible race venues such as Houston, Denver, Miami,
> > keeping Vancouver and the like; the failure to address an outdated
> > formula; the fiascos of Hawaii and Rio; even the alienation of Honda and
> > Toyota and the defections of Penske and Ganassi were all applauded and
> > cheered by CHUMPS claiming CART was headed in the right direction.
> >
> > And CHUMPS were not relegated to simply fan-based Internet forums.  We
> > saw them in the more legitimate press as well under such names as Robin
> > Miller, Brock Yates and others.  Yet others were to be found running Web
> > sites with seeming large followings such as AR1.  To what extent do
these
> "fans" shoulder some responsibility for CART's
> > demise?
>
> Serious answer.....you can't blame the fans for piss poor management of
the
> company. I also think the reason most die hard CART fans have never had
> anything good to say about TG is that they see that his agenda has always
> just been to get control. He's basically been full of shit in terms of his
> statements as to why he built the IRL - he's just a control freak and that
> doesn't sit well with a lot of people.
>
> Aside from that, the IRL cars have been pig ugly & technically
uninteresting
> & the racing format is monotonous.
>
> Besides, CART as a racing format is not dead yet. CART as a company may be
> but that's not the same thing at all. As we discussed some months ago I'd
> still say the chances are better than even that there will be some form of
> OWR apart from the IRL running next year. The number of races may be
limited
> and so might the field be - but if it runs it will damage the IRL in
spades
> simply by continuing to split race fans between two series.

You have got to be a nutcase. Nothing that anyone puts on a street parade
will ever damage the IRL. When Cart held all the cards, it couldnt keep the
IRL from growing. Your Andrew Craig like mentality is humerous.
>
> >If they had spoken up instead of following CART like blind
> > lemmings might the kind of pressures they could have brought to bear
> > have prevented CART from going over the cliff?
>
> I doubt it but it would have been worth a shot. It's something I believe
IRL
> fans should be looking at right now as I think have said on one or two
> occasions recently.

I like oval Indycar racing. Why should I worry? As long as Tony doenst lower
himself to putting on parades and that includes Long Beach.  If Tony decides
to road race, then I certainly hope he decides to look at natural terrain
raod race courses that lend themselves to great battles.
>
> Ultimately we need one series - its not CART and its definitly not the IRL
Really? It certianly seems to be looking that way Mr. Craig! :-)
> and it can't be run by any of those who have been running either CART or
the
> IRL - too many people on either side as fans or those involved in the
sport
> who won't accept management from the "other side". We need someone new to
> come in & take it on with someone like Mario out on point to promote it to
> the fans.
Forget Mario, too damn wishy washy anymore. And dont bother parading
Gentlehozzi either. Another joke.
>
> Tony needs to get back to running his track, the month of May needs to be
> put aside for Indy, Tony and the teams need to start a Privateer funding
> program to increase the number of competitors at Indy and we need to get
> back to a mixture of Roads, Streets and Ovals - something for everyone.
One
> or two decent American drivers who win some races probably wouldn't hurt
> either.
>
> ....and none of it will happen.
>
> IRL fans believe Tony can do no wrong & is the "second coming" and don't
> won't question what he's done or where he's going....
I wouldnt go that far Andrew, I do not like the engine package, and the cars
are not high on my list either.
>
> There will be no new management because Tony's ego wouldn't allow it -
he's
> a control freak.
Well, someone had to step in as those like Andrew Craig once said "Indy is
just another race".
>
> He might throw in a couple of road races but not enought to interest a
large
> enough caucus of fans in the whole series
>
> ....and the teams will continue to employ the best drivers they can (which
> mostly means non Americans.)
>
> All of which means that if CART struggles on the "Split" stays as wide as
> ever. If it doesn't and the IRL is the only game in town then unless
> something happens to make it significantly more interesting the audiences
> will still be crap and ultimately its viability will come into question if
> it fails to generate enough TV and Sponsor money. WHatever, a sizeable
core
> of CART fans will continue not to watch it because it's format is, for
them,
> mind numbingly dull and contrived. Some will just not watch it on
principle.
> Tony should not assume that because he has the only game in town everybody
> will want to play......there is more to life than racing.
>
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