Re: Confirmation "Enterprise" is in Alternate Universe ('Carpenter Street' spoilers)

"Timo S Saloniemi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> "D M"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> >spoiler space
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
> >.
>
> >According to Daniels, the war with the Xindi should never happen --
"History
> >doesn't mention anything about a conflict between Humans and the Xindi"
> >"The events that are taking place are the result of temporal
> >incursion...they're not suppose to be happening",
>
> Whee! Reset button done with gusto. It's only when they are ashamed of it
> themselves that it ill serves the story. As a major arc point, I warmly
> welcome it.
>
> >Questions
> >1. When is/was the temporal incursion?
>
> Don't ask me, I haven't seen this one yet. Wait, you didn't ask.
> But you know that won't stop me.

Actually he did ask! ;-)

>
> One might guess it was after Daniels' "death" in his personal linear-time
> terms, or he would probably have taken some sort of corrective action
> previously already. When that would be in Archer's personal linear-time
> terms is open to question, but surely the Florida-Venezuela Ditch Project
> took years to prepare. The incursion should have been well before 2151...
> But why back in the 20th century? How could the meddler plausibly
> present the primitive Earth as an interstellar threat to the Xindi?

Sorry, 20th century? This last episode was eary 21st, but just as well might
have been 20th century. But I though the Xindi in that episode were from
Archer's time?

>
> >4. How Daniels not know "anything" about the Xindi attack on Earth and if
it
> >was as a result of  temporal incursion, like he says, why can't they just
> >work to correct the incursion ?
>
> If this was possible, the temporal cold war should never involve the
> natives at all. Any action could be countermanded within the same split
> second it was taken, and we wouldn't get any main character involvement
> whatsoever.
>
> Why it isn't possible is a big question, but also one that is bound to
> have a technobabble answer that makes limited sense. Perhaps we shouldn't
> be asking.

Well put.

>
> >5. What was the reason Daniels couldn't go back in time and fix the
problem
> >of the Xindi incursion himself instead of coming up with the
over-elaborate
> >scheme to send Archer and T'Pol (why them?)?
>
> Perhaps he always needs sidekicks and henchmen to do his dirty work, or
> it won't "stick" in the timeline - and he didn't want to inform the
> natives of the 20th century.

Maybe less of a problem if Archer and co. get caught; they can't give away
info and technology they don't know and don't have.

>
> >6. Daniels says; "The changes haven't reached us, yet [meaning in the 31
> >Century]It takes a while for changes to ripple through the time-line"
> > What the hell?  The effects in TOS: "City on the Edge of Forever", DS9:
> >"Past Tense" and many others showed they were instanteoneous.
>
> But not consistent. Clearly, there are several very different time travel
> methods available in the Trek universe. And there could quite well be room
> for one that works on the BTTF principle...

Sorry, BTTF?
As far as being consistent, Kirk and the others were still there, they
didn't vanish, unless (as in Star Trek: First Contact) they were protected
somehow from timeline changes.

>
> >7 Could the Xindi have sent the whale probe from ST4? It would make sense
if
> >you consider;
> >(a) They like sending hostile probes
> >(b) The whale probe would have achieved their ultimate goal
> >(c) They have an intelligent marine species
> >(d) We know they're into time-travelling, so they could have ascertained
the
> >date humpbacks became extinct?
>
> Hey, that's a *really* good one! :)

That is a good one, especialy point (c).

>
> The only problem (aside from TPTB being incapable of such things) is
> the ultimately benevolent nature of the whale probe. Why did it retreat
> in the end? If the plan was driven only by an eco-activist faction of the
> marine species, would they have the resources to get the probe built?
> If the other species helped, why would they follow the whims of the
> aquarian eco-nutcases?
>

Maybe the aquatic ones were worked into a furor over the loss of the whales,
and when a whale surfaced (why only humpback? did *all* cetaceans, including
dolphins, go extinct too?) the probe lost its reason for doing what it did.

Tim