Re: More tech than sci Q -- best size for community

On 29 Nov 2003 11:00:22 -0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jaak Suurpere) wrote:



>And then there is the railway stop. I understand that the railway is
>partly underground - passing under the community centre - and partly
>on surface. Trains/cars are big enough that they are not private, yet
>they are small enough, with timetable flexible enough, that ambulance
>vehicles can be sent to a railway station in a few minutes.

The ambulance car runs on a track dedicated to police and medical
emergencies. No stops from pick-up point to hospital.

>There is freight traffic on railway as well. Small trains - perhaps
>one or a few cars - might encourage frequent timetables and avoid long
>waiting times.

Many cars running simultaneously. The schedule can be a car arriving
every five minutes, with three minutes loading time.

>As stated, the inhabitants are encouraged to use the rapid traffic by
>subsidies.

Um, no. The 'encouragement' is that there is simply nothing else
available. 

>Now, let us think. What is the average speed of the ordinary passenger
>trains? With stops every 1-3 miles?
>
>We have the constraints that a) emergency vehicles need up to 14
>minutes to reach hospitals (but they have dedicated tracks and don't
>need to stop so often) and b) most jobs are within 15-30 minute
>commute inclusive of waiting times and other stops.

My concept is that the townlets are grouped into pods. 

Picture an ellipse -- at one end is an uninhabited townlet with a
hospital, large stores, offices, etc.; at the other end is an
uninhabited townlet containing factories, a distribution/handling
center for food and supplies, etc. Along the squashed sides are
arranged the inhabited townlets, six to each side. 

a) Worst case scenario for a medical emergency is that your townlet is
closest to the factories, meaning that you're six stops from the
hospital. Of course, the ambulance doesn't have to stop at all -- it
has a clear track for the 9 miles (average distance between townlets
is 1.5 miles, but can be as short as 1 mile or as long as 3).

b) Unless you work within a townlet in your pod, you won't take a
local (which stops at every station), but an express to one end of the
ellipse. If you don't work there, you switch to an express that takes
you to the pod where you do work. Assuming you've unwisely chosen to
live in the wrong place spot , well, you'll just have to put up with
another change to get you to the place within that pod where you work.

>We have the constraints by the express transit: "nothing more than an
>hour away"? Well, present-day express trains achieve slightly over 200
>mph in cruising (the French TGV system). Frequent stops for
>interchange stations might slow it, plus waiting for local train,
>waiting for express train and thavel times of both the local trains.
>
>Hm. For this... If you imagine 10 millions of people scattered over an
>area of 12 000 square kilometres, 

The pods are arranged in concentric circles, with relatively
high-speed (80-120 mph) trains both circling and on spoke routes.

Worst case scenario: you're living on the innermost ring and must
reach a destination on the outermost ring that is 147 degrees away.
You express to your hospital townlet, switch to a high-speed which
rings you to the 135 degree spoke, switch to a high-speed which takes
you to the outer ring, and grab an express to the pod that you want.

>with salient points that a) there is
>little agriculture - unbuilt land is wildreness and food is imported
>by freight trains

Um, no. The food originates at switching yards within the city.
(That's complicated, but the reason for the story.)

> b) building of houses for less people than 700-800
>or without train station is avoided 

The standard community is rows of townhouses. This is actually more
efficient than blocks of apartment buildings.

'Without a train station' isn't avoided, it's completely impossible.

>c) concentration of buildings is
>avoided as well - the next house will be 5000 feet from a house
>600-800 feet long, with no regions of denser settlement... how will it
>feel like?

If someone wants a crowd, there's always the theatre . . . :)