Re: [News] Japan's New Export

Peter Van Huffel wrote:
> You obviously have a twisted logic, because you're reading things that have 
> not even been said. Noone said something about "superior", the statement was 
> about being "different"!
> In the universe of SEQUENTIAL ART, there are many different genres. Calling 
> french "bandes dessinées", "french comics" *is* degrading. Calling "manga" a 
> sort of "Japanese comics" is also degrading. The reason why? Not because 
> "comics" are inferior (which is what you seem to think what was meant by it), 
> no, because "manga" *are different* from "comics".
> In your logic, you wouldn't mind me calling an x-men-comic an "American 
> manga", I hope?

Well... The Japanese would. Actually, they might. They also tend to use 
"komikkusu" as well as "manga" and I'm not sure they make any difference 
of consideration.

Ultimately, you're wrong. Manga are comics. Comics are manga. We use 
different words just to make communication easier. We say "comics" 
instead of "sequential art" because it's, as Morgana said, more terse. 
Same with "manga" and "Japanese comics" (or, god forbid, "Japanese 
sequential art.")

> No sir, it can only be out of arrogance that you think that everything abroad 
> is a derivative of what you have at home.

Except she wasn't.

> Yes, let's continue in the same vein and make some other derivatives, most of 
> them I've already seen in the past and they make me cringe (trying not to 
> shock people here, but it's to make my point clear):
>
> mosque = Arabic church
> cosmonaut = Russian astronaut
> ramen = Japanese noodles
>
> Such descriptions are generally used to give children a point of reference, 
> but once you grow up, you should outgrow this and start using the correct 
> word for things you describe, because the correct term will be infinitely 
> more accurate. It's also simply a matter of respect towards another culture 
> to use the original word.

Except the Japanese don't always, either. Hell, they don't even use 
"anime" all the time, sometimes using "animeeshion." (My romanization 
may be a bit off.)

> > insufficient about the word "comic."  To demand that we don't call them
>
>
> And you are really stubborn, because I repeat for the nth time that I nor the 
> original article said that comics are inferior. It's the combination of the 
> two "JAPANESECOMIC" (I'll write them as one word, maybe you'll finally see 
> it) that's completely insufficient. Maybe you don't realize it, but to most 
> people I know (ie non-americans) the word "comic" is very closely associated 
> to sequential art produced in America. As such: the Japanese do not produce 
> "comics" to me.

Well, it's probably not an entirely salient point, but in the six years 
I lived in England, they used the word "comics" to describe all their 
own, non-American, um... comics.

Regardless, though, the Japanese produce comics, they aknowledge as 
such, and the comic tradition was directly influenced by those selfsame 
American comics (well, and American animation, but that's pretty obvious 
given Tezuka's Disney-esque style leanings.)

> > comics is like demanding that we come up with a new word for "film" in
> > reference to Japanese cinema, since "Seven Samurai" and "Ran" are obviously
> > *so much more* than films.   By saying that, you're basically ignoring all
>
>
> That's an incorrect comparison. By your logic, I should search for new words 
> for "book", "magazine"..., because they can be foreign? Do not confuse the 
> form with the content.

Umm... "comic" IS the form.

I'm not seeing the point in insisting on the difference between the two, 
other than country of origin. The influence of comic artists is pretty 
international. We've got a lot of comic artists who are taking their 
cues from manga, and there are likewise many manga artists who are 
inspired by American comic artists. My own fave, Yukito Kishiro, has 
great respect for Frank Miller, as the style of Ashen Victor showed. And 
there's a lot of fans of Mike Mignola among manga artists. Likewise 
there's a lot of European influece, both ways. Otomo and Moebius, 
anyone? (I think it's those two who are friends.)

Actually, there's a thought. if "Japanese comics" is degrading, is 
calling them "manga artists" likewise degrading? Should we insist upon 
saying "mangaka?" And keep applying this slippery slope until we all get 
to the point of just speaking Japanese?

I'd honestly -like- to, but it's not exactly an easy language to learn. 
(Not for lack of trying, either.)

Damien Roc