Re: Mormon chick, I have a question...

"Harry Palms" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On 25 Nov 2003 19:19:15 -0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Garrison Hilliard)
> wrote:
>
> >Why aren't there any African-American leaders of the LDS, and why
> >won't there ever be? I mean, outside of that Mormon dogma that
> >Africans are cursed forever,
> >enternally irredeemable and therefore cursed with black skin as
> >written in the Book Of Mormon?
> >
> >Damn, you Mormons are fucked up.
>
> Oh come on that's not fair. There are lots of black leaders of the
> church. Sure, no one in the big 15 is black. Not sure about the
> seventy. But whenever the leaders can find a black guy they will try
> to find a leadership position for him. Lets see, the church has Thurl
> Bailey, that singer chick, and there was one black guy in my ward in
> the past 25 years. So the church is making progress. LOL.
>
> The biggest problem is getting the old Mark E. Peterson and Bruce R.
> McConkie fans to accept a black guy as their church leader. The
> younger generation of mormons are mostly progressive on race issues,
> the older generation unfortunately were poisoned for decades by
> Peterson, McConkie and the racist teachings pre-1978. Even my parents,
> who are nice folks, have a difficult time shedding their racist views.
> They still believe black skin is the mark of Cain and a curse, 25
> years after the doctrinal change.
>
>
> What the church needs to do now is continue moving into the 20th
> century.  It's the 21st century, but the church is just now emerging
> into the 20th century culturally. Here are some other changes that
> would help their image.
>
> Allow women to say opening prayer in Sacrament meeting. In November
> 1978, the First Presidency sent out a letter to bishops and Stake
> Presidents allowing women to pray in sacrament meeting, but it is
> still a policy, maybe an 'unwritten order of things' to open sacrament
> meeting with prayer from a priesthood holder. Women, currently, only
> say the closing prayer, if they pray at all.
>

This is utter nonsense. Sisters regularly say both opening and closing
prayers in sacrament meetings all over the world.


> Allow women to give the final talk in sacrament. Currently, the final
> talk is given to the highest ranking priesthood authority. If a
> husnabd and wife are giving the talk, the man automatically goes last.
> It's the unwritten order of things for a priesthood holder to have the
> final say. (except for F&T meeting which is an entertaining and wacky
> free for all) It's a little thing, but maybe treat women equally when
> it comes to speaking to the congregation. (except for F&T meeting
> which is an entertaining and wacky free for all)
>

Again, false. Women often give the final talk. It is usual for the "highest
ranking" to go last, true. But that may be a sister.

If the talks were, let's say, a youth, a male who was say a Sunday School
teacher or counsellor in a Elders' Quorum presidency and the Young Women or
Relief Society president, then the President would speak last.



> Allow women to be Sunday School president. Another little thing that
> bugs me. Women can teach sunday school but they can't be the Sunday
> School President. THere is nothing in the CHI that says the Sunday
> School PResident has to hold the priesthood.
>

Yes there is. Unfortunately I do not have my copy to hand, however if you
insist I will post the wording at another time.

> Stop telling adults what movies they can watch and how many earrings
> they can have and otherwise treating them like little children who
> need help going potty. It's degrading and insulting to intelligent
> adults to have petty little decisions like that made for them by other
> adults.

Giving, and receiving advice, are an adult way to go about things.

The instruction relating to number of earings was given in a youth setting.
It may well be applicable to adults, but there is no rule which members must
abide by, nor any comeback if they do not.

Andrew R.